A Hero's Journey & The Fool's Journey, A Journey of Transformation and Self Discovery

A Witch, A Mystic & A Feminist

The Hero & Fool’s Journey 

Christy  

happy to stay podcast land and welcome back to a witch, a mystic and a feminist. We are very excited to be here with you today, as always, really? Let's just put that out there. But yeah, how was everybody's week? My Week was very long and stressful. But it's over now. So I'm good.

Marlena  

Well, I ended my week with a past life regression event. It was via zoom. The gentleman's name is Michael Armstrong. And he led this past life regression, hypnosis meditation. And so that was pretty cool. It was my first time doing that in a live group setting. I mean, even though it was via zoom, it was still live. So that was my first time doing it, like not on YouTube or whatever. It was pretty cool. Like it was, it was definitely pretty cool. I did see something. And so he had 528 hertz music on, he was asking a lot of people how they were feeling. A number of people, myself included, said nervous. One thing he mentioned in it, and I love this is he was saying that being nervous is your body's way of getting ready to do something courageous. And I was like, Oh, that really stinks. Like, I don't know why that's never been like, in my head before. But I was like, yeah, really, I get that, I totally get that. And in the past couple years, I've been trying to be more courageous. And so I find myself nervous all the time. And I was like, I just have anxiety. And it's like, Oh, that makes more sense. And so you know, I love that he said that, but he was basically getting us into a trance like state to be able to have these past lives show up. Alright, cool. And he was also talking about how some people get nervous before these past life regressions, because people are like, what if I was a bad guy in a previous life, am I gonna learn, right? And so he was saying that those, quote, bad guys are new souls, and we've all been new souls at one point or another. And so you know, the goal of life and reincarnation, and coming back to the School of Earth basically, is for our souls to evolve. So he was saying that the life that you see is what your soul is guiding you to see. It's what it wants you to see in that moment. So kinda like Jamie with your, with your past life regression, hypnosis, and it brought you back to you doing something with your father in a barn. And you know, just to him teaching you how to do things. That was what your soul was trying to show you in that moment, what it felt you needed to know, in that moment. So there was like 170 plus people on the Zoom. And he was saying that in like maths, guided meditations with that group setting the energy, it makes it easier for everybody to kind of connect. He was also saying that because he sent us the replay of it as well. And so if you see glimpses to go back and replay it, and it might open you up more to that past life, and you'll be able to see more and understand more. So while I haven't done so yet, I plan on going back because what I did see was I was a man, and I'm looking through my own eyes. So I had this feeling of being in New York City. There's cars going by, but this is in the late 1800s, early 1900s. I'm with a bunch of gentlemen, we all have suits on and long jackets, and like the cabbie style hats. You know, and again, oh, yeah, ours are going back and forth. But it's just a feeling that I was in New York City. It wasn't like the bright lights and everything that we see now. It was just that feeling. We were all laughing and jovial and, and then I think I fell asleep. Or I just don't remember anything else. Except starting to come out of that. So that was super cool. I definitely want to learn more about that. Yeah. So I'm excited to try it again. So that was what I did. That was my exciting, like, big thing. What about you, Jamie?

Christy  

Can you beat that?

Jamie  

I don't think I can beat that. My life is uh, is pretty. I'm all about finding all the things I can do. So that's why I'm trying to like vigorously, like just research stuff and look at things and read things and Yeah, well, the things, just all the things. So we'll continue on my whole 30 journey this month and dry January. And we're on day 13. And

Christy  

is it better than last week?

Jamie  

Yeah, it's a it's a it's a lot. I was I was okay. If I was angry Jamie this weekend, um, for those that know, I work from home, I don't know if I've discussed that on the podcast. So I'm very much an extrovert I need outside, I need social interaction, I need a release and a break from my house, my family at times, my job, all the things because everything is in my house. So there are days where I just don't get out unless it's five minutes to go drop my kids off at school. And when I don't get that freedom, that release, when we'd have our Friday night, date nights, or whatever it might be, I go crazy, I get I get angry. And it's don't get me wrong. I know there are things we can do outside of eating and drinking all the things. But that's kind of been our release on our date nights. And trying to find new things is a challenge. And my husband's doing this with me, this is our third time doing hold 30. And he would rather he's very much an introvert, he's good staying home, I'm good. I don't need to go to a restaurant, I can order the things I want. Like he wants all the pastas and all the breads and all the things and I need to get out. So it's hard thing about this program is it does make you look at your food issues, if you will, or your addictions or your tendencies to have to do certain things and challenging you to find other things to do or to eat or whatever it might be. So it's a deep dive into that. And I'm kind of you know, I got two more weeks ago, almost halfway through. But all as well. I do like, I feel way more clear headed. How I feel during the day from the foods I'm taking in the lack of alcohol, I feel 100 million times better. I love this feeling. But I also love the release feeling too. So it's trying to find that balance. But yeah, that's, that's my week. I'm sticking to it. Yep. I'm good, though. I'm good. I feel good today. And it's it's the morning and I'm happy. And I'm very interested in this topic we're going to discuss today. So yes,

Christy  

yes. Okay, well, if you guys listened last week, we talked a little bit or now a little bit or whole talk was on spiritual awakenings. And we touched a lot on the stages of spiritual awakenings. So this week, we are actually discussing, it's called the hero's journey and the major arcana. So if those two things are very unfamiliar to you, if those terms just don't ring any bells, we're going to explain what we know about both of those topics, discuss how the two the hero's journey and the Major Arcana intersect how they kind of tie together. The other thing is, like I said, if you listened last week, you might recognize some of the stages of spiritual awakening and how they kind of tie in with the hero's journey. So just kind of keep that in mind as we're talking. So yeah, I will jump in. If you don't worry, I'll jump in to give you kind of the rundown on a hero's journey. So this framework was first discovered by a man named Joseph Campbell in 1949. So it's old. But it's an archetype or a template for a story. So if you think about your movies, really, it's prevalent movies, books, all the places, but it lays out a template for this kind of plot. And in this plot, you have a hero, and the hero is normally an everyday person. And so the way that the hero's journey is represented is in a circle. And at the top half is your ordinary world. So that's every day world in the bottom half is a special world. Okay, so right away, you can kind of see how this would track with a spiritual awakening, right? Because you're in your ordinary world. And then if you follow the circle around and you descend into the special world, or your spiritual world, things happen there, and then you ascend back up to your ordinary world, a changed person. That's just a very general overview. There's a lot to it in your spiritual journey. And I know in my spiritual journey, I spent a lot of time in the descent. I hung out there. And that's normal too.

Marlena  

I pitched a tent down there.

Christy  

It's a tent, it's totally fine. But it that's where there's a lot going on. So you can just kind of think of it as a circle and, you know, not just for stories and movies, but also for our lives. A lot of things are in circles when I was like, oh my god, we did like the spiritual awakening. We did grief. Like, all these circles, I don't

Marlena  

know. Well, I liked the circles though. And I like that because I do. Yeah. You know, we look at life. So everything's so linear, you know, time is linear. Everything that we go through is linear. If you look at stages, it's a timeline, in essence, but with a circle, it's just kind of flowing. And so I like looking at life and this hero's journey, and we'll go into the fool's journey with the Major Arcana, but in this circle, they call it the circle of life, and not this timeline. Yeah.

Christy  

Right. And like, and like we mentioned last week, right? The stages of awakening aren't linear, you know, hero's journey in a movie in a book, okay. It's it's a nice, neat circle. With a bow. It's all Yeah, it's all tied up at the end. But you know, in our own lives, like we said, we pitched a tip at the underworld, I guess you could say, we could attend down the belly of it. You know, you can also kind of, as you're ascending, you might then descend, right? Again, right? You might go back and forth in our lives, not a linear process. But in stories, this is, it would be lovely. If that's how it worked in real life, like, oh, look, I'm on the rebirth section. Now. I'm gonna go to resurrection. I don't know. Like now now you got some more work to do to go back to your tent? Yeah, so that's the overview of hero's journey.

Marlena  

So for me, the hero's journey itself, when he started, I didn't really pay attention much to it. And then it started coming up and coming up and coming up. And I was like, This sounds to me like the Fool's Journey. And Taro. And so that's where I was just like, Oh, I love the correlation between the two. For me, it's like the TV show Once Upon a Time. Oh, yeah. I loved that show. And I had started watching it again, middle of last year. And as I was watching it, and that's really where the hero's journey kind of like, clicked for me as well. And then I was like, oh my god, this is like the Major Arcana And Taro. Because Emma, the main character, living her life in Boston, and all of a sudden her son that she doesn't know is her son comes out and says, You're a hero, like you're supposed to save Storybrooke or whatever it was. And then they go on this adventure. And so I was like, Oh, my God, that's an

Christy  

excellent show to kind of reference because she literally does go to a special world like she, she goes to us. Yeah, she went to the the storybook land or whatever it was. But the I had forgotten about that as a very clear and she

Marlena  

had to defeat the evil queen. Yes. Yeah. So if

Christy  

you are still confused by hero's journey, go watch once upon a time, it will clear it up. It's a very, that's very seasons

Marlena  

one through five, season six success. And I will say that over and over again, because they changed all the characters. I really enjoyed that show. And then when I watched it again, last year, I saw it with a new perspective with new eyes. So that was, that was pretty cool for me, too. I love doing that. Like after going through all of this and my spiritual awakening, being able to see things in perspective that I didn't necessarily have in the past. And sorry, that was my little tangent. So no,

Christy  

you know, I came across hero's journey, like in stories, right? Like so like writing and it was very brief. This is like, a template you can use, like, everyone uses it, you should use it too. And then it came back up in spirituality and in one of the classes I was taking, and I was like, sounds really familiar. Like, okay, so yeah, and it definitely has made a comeback like it's definitely more prevalent in the spiritual world. So I'm glad we're all aligned there. So now we're going to transition to Major Arcana, which is new subject matter for me. Very excited.

Marlena  

So just a little brief overview with regards to tarot cards, talked about what the hero's journey, Joseph Campbell from 1949 So the earliest references to tarot cards were in the 1400s in Italy, but it's believed that they were created even before that. They were introduced as a card game No. And if you look at the Minor Arcana, you see you have ace through 10. And then you have the court cards which are similar to a regular deck of cards. So this was introduced as a card game. In the 18th century, though French occultists started using tarot cards as a divination tool to tell the future Sure, or get validation. And so that's where the change was made. Or at least that's my understanding of it. Yeah. So super fun fact that I doing a little bit of research and stuff like that I wasn't aware of this, but the title game module, yeah. That is actually used as a divination tool as well, using numerology, and astrology to be able to tell the future or validate certain things. But yeah, so Taro started off as a card game, and then, you know, transitioned into a divination tool. And with the Major Arcana, there's 22 cards starting with zero, which is the full. And this is the fool's journey. And I think we've mentioned this before in previous episodes, when we talked about Taro. When the cards come out, you use your intuition to tell a story. And here in the Major Arcana, the story is the Fool's Journey. And so you go from zero being the fool to card number 21, which is the World card where basically you have completed that circle, which we're going to go into. And like I said, Before, the hero's journey, the concept of that started coming into my life and being in my face kind of thing. It correlated a lot with the Fool's Journey. And so that's how I was able to understand it a little bit better. So I kind of wanted to discuss that, in that, you know, the correlation between the two with the fool. And again, card number zero, it's this guy who represents or this person, I won't say this guy, I'm like, we are women. So she, she, the fool. She represents a person in this present moment unaware unafraid of the journey before her. And it's her innocence, and her openness that makes the adventure possible. And that is the ordinary world in in the hero's journey, the hero's journey. And then we go into the call to adventure. And those two cards, basically, there's two cards that kind of work with that. And that's the magician card and the High Priestess. While the magician and the High Priestess, those are your Higher Selves, basically, the magician is the masculine to that. Harnessing one's ability to to basically transform experiences and situations or even oneself, okay, the High Priestess is the feminine portion of that very feminine and intuitive. Okay. And so I know for me, like with the beginning of my spiritual awakening, and I kind of didn't understand what was going on. But I was leaning a lot more into my feminine or the High Priestess, I started using my intuition more my gut feelings. I remember at the beginning of my, my awakening, my kid, wanted to go out with some friends, and it was pouring down rain. And the rain was supposed to stop by the time they were going to go out. But I just had this knot in my stomach. And so I actually tried to push it on to Vince. I said, Ask your father. And Vince was like, Yeah, go ahead and go. And then I still kept having that feeling. So I called Vince and I was like, Listen, I have this bad feeling. I don't think that they should go. It was like, Well, if you're having a bad feeling, trust your gut. And so I called the kid and I was like, actually, I don't want you to go. And it's not because I don't trust you or anything. I just have a bad feeling. Right? And they were 100% okay with it in that moment being like, Oh, well, you know, okay, if you have a bad feeling I'm not anywhere. Yeah. So I'm trusting my my intuition. And that was looking at my spiritual awakening and looking at these cards and the hero's journey and the Fool's Journey. I think that was one of the times that I really remember a situation like that occurred.

Christy  

Well, it's interesting to me, because like, I'm looking at this and I don't know if there's any correlation, but I'm like, Okay, so in the call to adventure, I mean, you have to embrace your feminine and masculine energy to really like forge ahead. Right. And I, I mean, that's just me, I don't know. But it wouldn't make sense, right? You have to embrace both sides in order to, I don't know, continue on

Marlena  

in looking at this and the correlation between the hero's journey and the Fool's Journey. I don't know if you necessarily need like all of those cards, because again, not everything is linear. And so sometimes, you're going to lean more into your masculine I tend to, as we all know, I tend to leaned more into my masculine than I do my feminine. And so there's a there's a time when it's time to balance those. And so I think that within this, you could have one or the other or both. Yeah, that makes sense. So you know, and then going into the refusal of call, there really isn't a card that goes with that, where the fool or the or the hero refuses to fix the problem, I think there really isn't a card for that. But then you go into meeting the mentor, and your mentor could be one or all of these cards, which is the Empress, the emperor, the hierophant, or the lovers. And so the Empress is the earthly counterpart to the High Priestess, considered the mother of the full, she's loving and abundant, providing feminine power and feeding nurturing the full, whereas the emperor is more of the father figure, again, very masculine, all about foundations and boundaries, and protecting the quote realm. And then you have the hierophant, who provides knowledge from heaven to earth, and through like strong teachings. And looking at the card, if you look at the card looks almost like the Pope, you know, religious type thing. And then you have the lovers, which is really the power of choice. Okay. So for me, like, in again, in my awakening, when I was I remember speaking to my mom, and I'm like, Okay, I don't know what's going on. But I feel like batshit crazy right now. And she was like, you need to contact your cousin, who has dealt with all of this before. So I call my cousin and she gets me in touch with her Shaman. And so, you know, I kind of see that as the shaman being the hierophant. For me. At that point, I started learning more about about what I was going through, and some of the shamanic practices and stuff like that, and very much a teacher in teaching me how to look within deal with what I was going through looking within, you know, doing a lot of work on myself. And for me, the meeting the mentor was, I have to say, like meeting that Shaman.

Christy  

Yeah, wow, I want to meet a shaman.

Marlena  

And so then we that we crossed the threshold. And in looking at this, that's the chariot card. So this is when the fool has been educated, and now must apply this to the real world. It's her graduation and a sign of moving forward. So that she's able to embark on this adventure, using what she is what she's learned from her mentors, and leaning into either her masculine or feminine, or both,

Christy  

right? This is where I get stuck a lot. Like

Marlena  

I'm in the chariot. Yeah, like, I'm

Christy  

graduation. I'm ready. Yeah, I like have the knowledge now. And I'm ready. But I don't want to write or like, I'm still like, like, maybe I can just wait a little bit. Like, I'll just Yeah, so I feel like I get stuck there. Like quite often. Like, even my spiritual journey is just, yeah, you got the knowledge now, what are you going to do with it? And you know, putting in the work now, right? Well, yeah, and a lot of times like that, between, you know, that stage and all your tests and your allies and your enemies. Like that's a very scary stage to move on to right because you don't know when you don't know what you're going to lose. You don't know what you're going to gain this most recent spiritual awakening for me, I think I don't know if I mentioned on the podcast, but like, my world, when we started this podcast went very quiet. And what I mean by that is like, there was an awful lot of people reaching out being like, Oh, you're, you're doing a podcast is amazing. Like, Oh, wow. You know, there wasn't and that's not what I was expecting. But it went like definitely quiet. And I knew there were people from my world, obviously, from your worlds to listening. Um, but nobody was saying anything. So that was really quite scary for me because I knew that some of those people listening were going to fall away from me right. And that was hard to see your world and your people really supporting you and reaching out to you and I really did have to kind of take your wins as my own and I did then I had to turn it into Okay, now I'm going to find new people right I'm gonna find new people lined up. But every time I've gone through a spiritual awakening, like that is always my my stopping point really, like that's really where it's hard for me to keep going because I don't necessarily want to lose relations or lose people, you know, I don't want to have enemies, like I want to. And allies sometimes are hard to find, or they're slower to find, I guess is the right way to put it for me. So yeah, that's, that's always a really sticking point for me, for some reason. Well, you

Marlena  

know, and again, as you were saying, as we start descending down this, you know, being down in these lower parts of the hero's journey, or the fool's journey, you know, we pitch a tent down there, because it's like, okay, I don't want to go, I don't want yeah, I don't want to blow up in my world, right? I want to go back to where I was naive, and come to everything had its place. Yeah,

Jamie  

yeah. Yeah. And I think this is where we sit a lot too. With impostor syndrome. We started thinking, do I really know what I'm talking about? Do I really know what I'm supposed to do? Do? Do I have enough strength and determination to finish this journey? And so it is very easy and comfortable to sit in this level? And think, hmm, I'm just gonna stay right here. This is where life is. Okay. This is where I feel safe. This is this is normal. So yeah, I very much agree with the fact that you can resonate in this little area for a long time. For a long time. Yeah. And I

Marlena  

think this wasn't going from

Christy  

stars I had, I wouldn't say it just add, I think this was the first time that I forged ahead. Is really like, it's and I'm

Marlena  

proud of you for that, you know, well, this adventure for this podcast adventure for us. You know, we are when it was in the fetus stage, and we are still in infancy stage. Yeah. But when it was in the fetus stage, I was like, I didn't want to tell anybody. Because I was like, there is a very good chance that I'm going to pull the plug on this. Because I don't even know why I want to do this, right? And what if people think I'm crazy, or what if I lose friends, I've lost people in my life. During the spiritual awakening, whether it be my choice or their choice. But I was like, Okay, now I'm putting this out there for the world to hear. And I'm about to just blow up my fucking world. Yeah, you know, and throw my world into chaos. And I'm doing that on my own.

Christy  

Yeah, I are choosing that. Yeah. On

Jamie  

purpose.

Marlena  

Yeah, you know, so. So I get what you're saying. And we're here to support each other, you know, and we have our outside support with our spouses and, and some families, but we want that support.

Christy  

Yeah, I mean, and to be clear, for me, this time, losing people happen a lot quicker than gaining people. Right. And I think that I think that's normal, right? Whenever you change, I think losing people comes very quickly. Or fairly quickly. But as I started to allow myself to lose people, I started gaining people, right. And people that like, I had maybe met a couple times before or like, you know, people like I didn't expect, like, I could have never imagined that I would have gained like these many people and those people, funny enough, like they had no interaction with the podcast. So it's not like we connected over that. It was we connected. And then it was like, Oh, you do a podcast? And I'm like, yeah, and then they started supporting me. And I'm like, Oh, this is what this feels like. But it's kind of amazing, right? But I had to sit and kind of shit of losing people, right? And feeling very just kind of alienated and alone. To then feel this, like, wow, I could have never like imagined how my I'll just say my social life. But like how these people really enriched me. And then even before knowing I did this, right? And now they're supportive. And like that, I'm sure allies Yeah, and that means everything to me. But I just don't think I had the courage before to kind of make it this far. Or I didn't have the support, maybe. But I just wanted that it is amazing. If you can kind of forge ahead, make it into the stage. Just knowing that you're probably going to lose fuel faster than your you'll gain them. And that's right

Marlena  

100% In a spiritual awakening, and in Hero's journeys in the fool's journey and stuff like that, you know, people do fall away. But the universe takes things away from you to be able to make room for what you actually need. So, you know, these people falling away, whether again, it's your choice or their choice, it's just really the universe making room for those that are supposed to be in your life that are supposed to enrich your life. So and I'm so glad that you recognize that

Christy  

Yeah, I mean, it did. It did take me a while but this like, You guys helped me like a great deal because, you know, it was I would tell you like it's kind of like I finally told you it's quiet. Like you guys are getting accolades and you know, people supporting you and And I've got zero right now that I was expecting to like, have people come out of the woodwork for me?

But I thought maybe like

Christy  

someone who was on my list, Instagram, not a lot of people did. And so I was like, Okay, well, this is interesting. This is a very interesting, dynamic and just like kind of watching it unfold. And that's how I approached it at first was from pre 1000 mile view, like, just okay, what what is going on, right? And then, and then I let myself feel it. And then you know, realize, okay, that's fine, but you are doing exactly what you want to be doing. You know what you need to do. So keep going.

Marlena  

And that was basically the next stage of the hero's journey works, right? Is the test the allies and the enemies? Where are you, you figure out who's really there for you and who's not? Right. And, you know, I know that a lot of us have felt that in life, just who's really my friend? Yeah, who's really there for me who's not right, yeah. So with those tests, allies and enemies, the cards that associated with that are the strength, the hermit Wheel of Fortune and justice. So the strength card is when the fool must overcome her base qualities by realizing that it's mind over matter. And at times, that's the best solution. And then from the strength card, you kind of go inside. And that's the hermit, where you're alone with your thoughts and away from the rest of the world and realizing that life is just a fucking game that we're playing, we all must play. So we win. And sometimes we lose. Yeah. But you know, the hermit is when you start going within. And really again, with the spiritual awakening, that's when you start doing your inner work. Yeah. And then you go into the wheel of fortune, which the wheel of fortune in itself is its own hero's journey, you know, it's its own circle of recognizing that life is ebbs and flows. It's, you know, ascension, dissension and going, going into the circle. And sometimes you have good luck. Sometimes you have bad luck, okay. And then we go into the Justice card where, you know, you've made these decisions based off of what you've been going through. And those decisions are made by trial and error. Yeah. Yeah. And so then the next part of the hero's journey, which is the approach, where we pitched the, the approach to the, to the innermost cave, that's the Hanged Man. And so that's when you feel kind of stuck you at this point, you have the decision to either quit the journey, or continue on. Okay. And that's where I normally sit a lot in that, where I'm just like, Yeah, I don't want to make a decision. Yeah, I'm just gonna hang here and see how long I can just hang between these two worlds kind of thing. And, again, not having to make decisions. Just one. I

Christy  

think we touched on that last week, too, that we all kind of, in our own ways, we're kind of stuck, right, like, right, well, what do we need to do next? And we all, you know, had different conclusions to her, or decisions what we needed to do next. I started therapy. Right. So that was my, my next step. But yeah, so we touched on that last week that we all kind of were in the same place at the same time without even talking about it and have since or are trying to move past that, right. And however we whatever we need to do, you're now you know, you did past life regression, and hopefully move to the next step and go, you know, not get stuck there in your tent. But yeah, that's it's hard work. Right? Like, yes, to go into the innermost cave

Jamie  

of yourself. Yeah. And I know, I was just gonna say, I know for me, in reading the hero's journey, and trying to relate a situation to it, this was an area for me where it was about accepting this possible new future for me. So when I related the hero's journey to a situation in my life, it was a broken off engagement, a life that I saw shifting in a complete another direction that I was not prepared for. And at this stage in the journey, it was, am I really accepting that I may have to be alone. Is this my destiny and I wasn't ready to accept that I. But I had to my mind kept saying you need to accept the realization that you could maybe be alone for the rest of your life. And, and that's an important reality that my mind kept saying, you have to accept this to move forward to move to the next possible stage. So for me, I'm trying to relate this hero's journey to another situation. I found myself in this moment for a few years. I'll be honest, it really took a long time because I did a lot of things to not be alone. During these three years that I'm some I'm not very proud of. And I really feel I was stuck in this stage for about three years. It took me a long time to get to the point of, okay, it's okay, if you're alone, you know what, you're actually a kind of a decent person. And that's all right. And you might, this might be your destiny. So let's move the fuck on. Sorry. But that was what I kept telling myself like to get myself out of this hole, because I really felt like I was just lost in this. This world right here. I felt like I was stuck. And I was afraid of accepting my possible future. Sorry, about that sat with me for a while for about three years of my life. I'm trying to get out of this tent in this world.

Christy  

So I mean, that's fair. I mean, it's not just like a month, right? You don't know how long it's gonna take you.

Marlena  

I mean, sometimes you can bounce right back. And sometimes you're just like,

Jamie  

yeah, you snuggle up in that little, little sleeping bag in your tent. You're like, I'm just gonna stay right here. Just right here, here. Yep, absolutely.

Marlena  

And so then we go into the ordeal. That's the death card. And this appears when the fool realizes that she wants took a blind eye to the truth, everything that her mentors have said, what, you know, the emperor, the emperor is The Hierophant, the lovers, everything that they said. And she, she took it with blind faith. And now she's starting to get her own perception of, of what's going on in her world. And this is where she really starts to have a new understanding and a new perspective. And so this is where you really start that transition into that upward swing in both the fool's journey and the hero's journey is that realization that you have your own thoughts, you have your own your own beliefs, that you're no longer blindly following what mom and dad said, or what the church has said, you've done all of this work, you've been tested. And now you're going back to that upswing.

Jamie  

Yeah, you've pulled the death card on me a few times, I've pulled

Marlena  

the death card. I've had the death card pulled on me a few times. You know, and really, it's it's a transition. And what we were talking about when we were talking about spiritual awakening, the death of the ego, no, yeah, now you have a new way of thinking. And really, it's not your mind, you're killing off your ego. Yeah, you're transitioning into this new person. Yep. So then we go into the reward. And that's the the temperance card, where now you are finding that balance, it's no longer extremes, you're you're finding that balance in between, you know, everything that you've been going through, you're finding that balance between the masculine and feminine, you have this middle road that you're able to go through. And I know for me finding balance is something I always strive for, but at times really missed the mark. And so when I am able to have that middle road, and I do find that balance, I really do think of the temperance card where she has one foot on the earth and one foot in the water. So one of the physical life one one in emotions, basically,

Jamie  

I love that vision of that card. I mean, just you describing it, I know I've seen it before, obviously, in my own deck in you reading for me, but that vision for me is just so reflective on where I feel like we're trying to ground ourselves in our spiritual awakening in this world, one foot planted and one foot in, in the earth in, you know, the divine universe, just all the things and so you saying that just I just feel like that's where we're striving to be? Yeah, right. Right. Just just having that level of balance, like you said, in both worlds and bringing them together. So that was just beautiful. I just had to say that. Sorry.

Christy  

It is.

Jamie  

It is beautiful. Yeah, I

Marlena  

know. I'm like I again, I missed the mark sometimes by you know, sometimes I'm able to hit it. And when I do, I'm just like, oh, this is what it feels like to be balanced.

Jamie  

Ah,

Christy  

yeah, let's live here a little bit. Yeah, I

Jamie  

wish I could pitch my tent, right.

Marlena  

I wish I could, too. But sometimes I'm like, you know, even a little less of that middle road. Exactly. And then we had to the road back and that is the devil card. And you know, the devil card doesn't necessarily mean the devil. It's those hidden spots or those shadows within the fool that begin to reveal themselves addictions, attachments, things like that. And so you've done all of this work, but there's still some shadows that are lingering. And so now they're starting to We'll make themselves aware surface. And so that's when we go into the next stage, which is resurrection. And, you know, I know this is my favorite stage of these fucking tower moments the tower card is. And I say that I'm being extremely sarcastic tower moments. And I feel every time I have a tower moment, I'm just like, seriously, seriously. But that's when basically your inner world starts to crumble. It's completely out of your control. And you've you've been shaken. Your world has been shaken. You know, it's like, didn't I just blow up my world? Just a few stages ago. Like, why? Why is this happening to me now?

Jamie  

Yeah, I'm supposed to be riding off into the sunset. Yeah, right. Yeah. Now this,

Marlena  

you know, and for me, anytime I've had a tower moment, I get so pissed off, because I'm like, I've done all of this work. I've done all of this work. I'm trying to be a good person. Why is this happening? Right? And you know, and then I have to take a step back and be like, Okay, now quit yelling. Why is this happening? What is the lesson behind this? You know, why are you going through this? It really look at it. But man, do I get pissed? And I'm just like, you know, what's the point of me doing all of this work? If my world just keeps crashing down around my shoulders?

Jamie  

Yeah, keeps giving me new challenges to overcome when I put in all the work. Why do I have to keep going through this? Yeah.

Marlena  

And the universe is like, Bitch, because that's life.

Christy  

Yeah, through this once here,

Marlena  

let me throw out another tower moment.

Jamie  

And it's like the saying everyone says, right, everything happens for a reason. And a lot of people interpret that as like, oh, well, this is how it's supposed to be. You know, and there is some truth to that. But everything happens for a reason also means because there's a less, there's less, there's something to be learned. This is this is going to help you guide, the next step. And the next tower moment that you're in. This is all part of life, and it's learning process for you. So yes, everything does happen for a reason that reason is probably a lesson that you need to learn or lesson for someone else that you're helping maybe mentor, or you're becoming an ally for them, you're helping them along their lifeline so well. And

Marlena  

like I said, I got really pissed off, and then you know, and I'm like, What's the lesson and I'm like, fuck this lesson.

Jamie  

I don't want a lesson. I don't want

Marlena  

you know, and that's when the rebellious side of me comes out. And I'm like, fuck this, I'm done. I'm done. You know, and there have been quite a few tower moments in my life where I'm seriously sitting there and like, curled up in the fetal position, crying being like, I am done. I can't take this anymore. You know, my, my entire world is falling apart. You know? And so you go through who? Something hit right there. Yeah, you know, you go through those tower moments, you go through that resurrection. And that's when you return to the Elixir. And this is the star card and star card, moon card, Sun card judgment and world. The star card is my absolute favorite card, and so much that from my favorite Tarot Deck, the solteiro deck, I actually have that star card tattooed on my forearm. Because that is the renewed hope that you have. I remember I got this tattoo just before Vince went into the hospital. I remember I just kept rubbing it going. Okay, this renewed hope I'm in my tower moment right now, this renewed hope is going to come very soon. Yeah. So come on, let's let's make this happen. I'm like, I know, I did not get this tattooed on me for no fucking reason. Like, come on.

Jamie  

So I was to happen, right?

Marlena  

Exactly. So the star star card is one of the most magical cards in the deck. It is my absolute favorite card in, in the deck. And that's when new ideas are planted. Some people will call it spiritual downloads, but you have these new ideas from the heavens. And then there's there's the moon card, and the moon card reminds the fool that there are still things that are still mysterious, that are uncontrollable, that you know is still has you questioning it, the fool starts to feel unclear of what the next step should be, what her next move is, but then the Sun card appears and that's when the sun comes out. It's no longer night. It's no longer dark. That's when you start to feel joy. And in the fool's journey, the full she's ready to return home with everything that she's learned. And then you go into the judgment card, where there's a revelation that whatever was left unsaid or undone This is the final work that needs to be completed. And then the World card, which is the end of this journey, hinting that there's a new cycle that's going to be done but too comfortable. Yeah, don't get too comfortable because you have another journey ahead of you. But, you know, this is when you're like, I wish I could pitch a tent there, where I'm like, Yeah, I've done all of this work. And you know, I've come to the finish line. And now I got my model and,

Jamie  

and we sit here forever and ever.

Marlena  

But, you know, it really does hint that there is a new journey coming, and then you start the cycle all over again. And again, you know, during this hero's journey, or fool's journey within our own life within our own, within our own soul. And one thing to understand with the Major Arcana, if you're looking at tarot cards is the major arcana is our souls journey. So those are things that are actually going to happen in your life. Whereas the Minor Arcana, those are daily lessons that, you know, you can actually change with decisions that you make. So the Major Arcana, those are lessons that your soul is here to learn. And so I find, especially like when I'm doing readings on myself, which I'm horrible at, but a lot of it is because of my own bias. But as I start getting some of these Major Arcana cards, all get the same one over and over again. But then I may go back to another part of the journey, and then jump forward to you know, a different part of the journey and kind of thing again, the correlation between the hero's journey and the in the Major Arcana, the fool's journey, I mean, it is the same. And really, it's just a reminder that that is life, you know, life is, you're going to be tested. You're going to find people who teach you and for me, like right now, I'm kind of in that space of, I am looking for mentors to teach me things and get me excited again, about just about life. And it's funny, I went to lunch yesterday with some events as college friends. And we were talking about, you know, as we've gotten older, trying to find things that bring us joy, versus what we used to do, you know, running. Yeah, let's go into this. Yeah, you know, running, running marathons. And you know, and stuff like that, that used to bring me joy, that no longer brings me joy, but like hiking now brings me joy, you know, and so finding, finding those different things, and you know, right now I'm trying to find mentors that bring something new to my life, and finding different allies who I do feel comfortable having deep conversations with, that's where I'm at in this journey. Right now. I don't know what this journey entails. But this present one, I'm looking for mentors and friends.

Jamie  

Yeah, that's like an ad, looking for mentors and friends started out.

Christy  

It's not a DD now it's a mentor, mentors and friends app.

Jamie  

I was just gonna say no, for me right now, in this moment, along a similar path. And I think because we're all on our spiritual awakenings are journeys, right now, we have similar things maybe we're looking for. Again, I'm also looking for that, that next big thing, if you will, I, in my, in my journey, in my awakening, I know the things I want to do, I know the things I need to do that I feel I need to do, I need to practice more, I need to meditate more, I need to do all these things more, more, more, more. And I'm kind of sitting in that in my tent, saying I don't have that drive yet to just leap forward. A lot of it too is just like you said Marlena, finding that next excitement that that person that maybe it's a mentor, or an ally, or it's a podcast, or listen to or it's a book, I end up reading or whatever, something that's going to spark that, that journey into the next plane and a muscle on a similar path as to finding that next thing that's going to spark that energy. You talked about running. And we've talked about the correlation with fitness and like, you know, how we can use it as, as it relates to that. And, you know, we ran a lot together when we were running, and I still find joy in that. I still find joy in that my body doesn't necessarily at this moment in time, but it is literally something that hangs over my head going get out and run right get out and run. I know my soul and my spirit needs to be outside right period. And I love what running does for me and the sense of accomplishment but getting back to doing it is like pulling teeth it is I'm just fighting tooth and nail right now. So yeah, I feel like very much just resonating in that that one zone and then just waiting for that tipping point. Just push me over. I'm right there. I'm on the cusp. I see that that one thing? Yeah.

Christy  

Yeah, I think I'm aligned with you. To be honest, just right there and ours right there. I mean, you're talking about running and you know, running used to bring me joy. It doesn't really matter. But being outside, right. So I've been trying to walk like, I've just been trying to, like, get out and walk right, just for my even sanity during my work day. Yeah. And it's helping, right. And it's not because it's not like, I'm like, Okay, you got to go do this, because you just ate like three slices of pizza. No, it's not, there's no, it's not punishment. It's like, I need I need to be outside. And when I'm not, I get to be angry, Christi. And very short with my family. So like, I'm trying really hard every day to get out and just walk even if it's just around the freakin block. Right for right. But you know, like, I also feel for me, like, I have a lot of things that bring me joy, but it's the discipline of doing them is really what now I have to teach myself, right. So I found things that I love and things that are amazing and vulnerable and authentic. But I have to prioritize them. And I also have to get off my lazy butt and like, make time to do it right and carve out that time, you know, and then I also feel like there's a ton of things that I haven't experienced yet. Like, like, I know, we talked about off when we're not recording, but you know, like, I'm like, Oh, I've never gone to like a shaman, like we talked about. I've never been to an energy healer, like I've never done, you know, Reiki, Reiki, Reiki, do, you know all these different things? I've had one. Psychic Reading, right? I'm like, I would love to do that again. So there's just all these other things. And I'm like, these other things could also bring me joy. Right? But then there's a part of me that's like, Yeah, but you've already got too much on your plate. Like maybe not now. Yeah, wait. But that is a lot of times my downfall is because I talk myself into you're too busy. Like you've got too much going on. When in reality, if I wanted to do it, I could find the time. Right. Like, just it's just like with anything. Right. So that is that is currently what I'm trying to do is just prioritize that make time for it. Right? Yeah, because there is time, you have plenty of hours in the day. So

Marlena  

priorities. And I'm also trying to find things that make me make me feel courageous, you know, things that I am afraid of, and I'm not talking about, like jumping out of a plane. That scares me and I'm I'm okay with not doing it. But doing things that I may be afraid of. But it's like, okay, why am I afraid? would things be better? If I just tried it? You know, try it before you say no. And so that's kind of also where I'm at in my life right now, where I'm just like, Okay, I'm going to try all of these different things. And it may scare me. But I also may really enjoy it. So just do it. And I'm like, you know, but it almost feels like I'm stepping out of a plane because of those nerves. And, you know, so going through that, that past life regression, and Michael Armstrong saying that, you know, being nervous is your body's way of getting ready to do something courageous. And that's something that I've been trying to do for like, the last year is, okay, it scares me. But I'm going to continue forward and try it because I don't want to live with what ifs, basically, right?

Christy  

Yeah, that totally resonates with me, because I actually read my poems out loud this week, to my therapist asked me if I would, and I was like, Oh, shit, she's like, You don't have to? And I was like, I know, I will. You know, this is not something that I do. Like, you can read them. That's fine. But like speaking that, like a total another, like, you know, a lot of times, they're emotional to me, right? So I get emotional. And I don't like when people see me emotional. And so that's, that's another thing, right? She asked, and I was like, okay, and I read her one. And then there was kind of a continuation. So I read her a second one. She told me she because part of my job is to push you a little bit. She goes, and I could tell that you were ready. But you also have the opportunity to say no, and I was like, Yeah, I was ready for that. I'm not ready for anything else. But it did feel like stepping out of a plane to go sky. Yeah, that's exactly what it felt like. And I had to stop in the middle like three different times. I guess I was talking so fast that I couldn't like my breath couldn't keep up with me. So I was like, Oh, I'm sure like, yeah, no guys have experienced that. I experienced that a lot. And so I had to like stop it. Okay, breathe. Calm down. She's not judging you. But it was like baring my soul, right? To someone who really in essence is a stranger. I mean, she probably knows me, you know, fairly well now, but you saying that, you know, you've been courageous. I was like, Damn straight. That was me being courageous.

Marlena  

God revealed that is amazing, because your poetry really is coming from your heart. You know? I've read your poetry and I can understand her wanting you to read it. And we as listeners can hear more of how you wrote it with the inflection in your voice. By the resistance of it's like, yeah, I'm just writing this. So,

Christy  

right, like, I'm not the spoken word poet.

Marlena  

I am so proud of you.

Christy  

Thank you guys. It was very nerve wracking. But I did it.

Jamie  

I will say the three of us all did step out of a plane together with this journey of Oh my gosh. We all went out together of that plane. We did the same time.

Marlena  

I really felt like we jumped out of the plane without a parachute.

Jamie  

We did nothing. We're still we're still descending. We.

Marlena  

But I am enjoying the journey as well. Yeah, absolutely. Really excited for what we have coming up. We started off the season with our guests, the salty twins. We have a couple of guests lined up. Yeah. So I'm excited to be able to bring more to our listeners as still trying to navigate and learn what we're doing.

Jamie  

I'm excited to learn. Yeah,

Christy  

exactly. We also have a new website. I mean, that's Thank you. To our producer. But yes, we have a new website. So a lot of new things coming. A lot of growth has happened writing for all of us. So it's going to be a great second season of this, this podcast.

Marlena  

Yeah. So we're still in the infancy stage. But you know, at least we're not in the fetus stage anymore. So kind of part of the hero's journey are we would

Jamie  

like, gosh, I definitely think we're crawling. Yeah.

Marlena  

So maybe we're, well, I don't want the interviews that are going to be coming up. We that's where we're kind of meeting our mentors and our ally. Yeah, you know, but I think we're kind of at the crossing the threshold where we're like, yeah, okay, it's the chariot card. We're going forward with us. Yeah, I agree.

Christy  

Yeah. Do we have to descend as a podcast? I mean, can we just not descend all the way and then like,

Jamie  

and then our parachute opens? And

Christy  

we skip some of this as a podcast? I don't know. We'll see.

Jamie  

Time will tell. So stick with us. Yeah. Listen to our hero's journey.

Marlena  

I think the first season you know, we really did go through a hero's journey of we're in our ordinary world. And it's like, all of a sudden, you guys got the call to adventure from good ol me.

Christy  

And we both kind of resisted.

Marlena  

Yeah. Oh, Jamie was had the big refusal. refusal of the call. It was like, my forehead. Like, I don't know if I want to do that.

Christy  

I guess with that we can. Is there any other anything else you guys want to say before we close?

Marlena  

like Christy said, we do have a new website. It's W MF pod.com. But we'll put that in the show notes. But go check that out. And so you'll be able to see our blogs, see some of the videos. You can listen to the podcast from there. Yeah, we have we have new things coming up this season. So please continue to stay tuned.

Christy  

Yeah, we hope that you guys keep listening every Tuesday. And just plugging that again Tuesday. And if this whole episode, you were like, I have no idea what you're talking about. You know, like, I don't know what a hero's journey was. I don't know what the Major Arcana was for hero's journey, your homework would be to go watch once upon a time, seasons one through five. And then you can report back and let us know like you know how you saw everything fitting because it really might make a lot more sense to you. If you watch it, watch a show and kind of keep hero's journey in the back of your mind and identify where they are at the certain points in the show. And then you know, for the Major Arcana, that's those are new things to me. So I learned a whole bunch today. And I would encourage you to continue learning as well and really see how the two intersect and how you can utilize that in your life. So with that, thank you for listening to a witch of mystic and a feminist. We'll be back next Tuesday. Check us out on all the socials follow us. And like Marlena said, please check out our website. We're very excited for all the new things to come in this season and for all of our guests. So we'll see you next week.