Feeling Like a Fraud: Navigating Imposter Syndrome

Imposter Syndrome

Wed, March 7, 2023

SPEAKERS

Marlena, Jamie, Christy

Christy  

Well, hello dear listeners and welcome back to another episode of a witch, a mystic and a feminist. We are so glad that you've tuned in today, we are talking about something that we have experienced over and over and over again and have talked about on the show. It is Dun dun dun. impostor syndrome. Yep. That's too much was too much. You we have talked about it a lot. And I know we've all experienced it a lot. So it's time for this episode to to happen. I think we're ready. 

Jamie  

I definitely think this is something that only us are very familiar with. But I think most people we know, have experienced impostor syndrome one way or another. At some point in their life for me, I know it's repeatedly. So I'm trying to work, trying to work through trying to just get better at believing in myself. And it can be so tough. Oh, tough.

Marlena  

And I know we've discussed it with this podcast how we've all had impostor syndrome just being like, Okay, we're going to start a podcast and like, Who would want to listen to us? But not just the podcast? I mean, we've experienced it in our professional lives as parents as spouses in our relationships in general. And it's just yeah, it's it's Yeah, I

Christy  

mean, let's let's not get too far ahead of ourselves because some people might might have experienced this but not actually know that there's a term for it right. So Jamie, what is impostor syndrome?

Jamie  

First of all, according to my daughter it's what's the game that has the imposters among us among us I was when I'm what I'm doing. She's like imposter imposter. You playing among us? I'm like, wow. So that if you're my daughter, think imposter syndrome are the little weird guys running around in among us but that's not what we're discussing today. Different imposter. I am, I know a child, let me tell you Mungus, you want to play? Anyways? We all know that I always have to go to our infamous Google when we are looking at for definitions. If someone were listening to our podcast right now and go, What the hell are they talking about imposter syndrome? What do we do we go to Google. So according to Google, and this is actually from Wikipedia. So there's a whole Wikipedia on this syndrome. Let me tell you, and you can go down the rabbit hole in it. But anyways, according to Wikipedia, it's it's also known as the imposter phenomenon, or imposter ism. There's a word for you. It is a psychological occurrence in which an individual doubts their skills, talents or accomplishments and has a persistent, internalized fear of being exposed as a fraud. They basically in essence, just, I don't want to say this because I know a lot of people live by this motto. It's almost sometimes like faking until you make it like that's how you feel, right? I'm an impostor. I don't even know what I'm doing, but I'm just gonna pretend until I get to where I need to be. So it also goes into they may think that they're deceiving others, because they feel as if they are not as intelligent as they outwardly portray themselves to be. When impostor syndrome was first conceptualized. It was viewed as a phenomenon that was common this is what I found interesting. That was common among high achieving women. Further Risha, I can't even talk C and pasta can't even speak. Further research has shown that it affects both men and women in the collective sense that the proportion affected are more or less equally distributed among genders. So then it goes into further but that's kind of the gist. I just found that piece very interesting that they originally had found that it was mostly felt by women. And I think we could go down the rabbit hole with that one. Why we I think we could. Yeah.

Marlena  

I think impostor syndrome is is rooted in insecurity. Absolutely. No, I have a ton of insecurities. I mean, I've done a lot of work, but man there's things that have taken place and I know like I said, I felt it in my relationships and things like that. And

Jamie  

you know, there's different things like you said, insecurities that can feel these emotions this phenomenon within us this imposter syndrome. Even calling attention to our successes can be a trigger, winning an award for example of promotion, passing an exam chill Children and teenagers and kids in college go through these things, these these feelings of also having failure after successes because now like you've been handed this major war, and then you fail, maybe in the same field, maybe in a promotion that you've received and you're not doing the job you're supposed to do. Well, now you're questioning everything you've just earned. Because you feel like you've failed, and upbringing that heavily stressed, achievement and success. So if you are brought up in a house that just reinforces nothing but success, you cannot fail, you cannot fail, you cannot fail that can definitely Oh my I know for me, I think about like, Oh, my God, my poor kid, my God, our parents are going oh, shit that I did. Yeah, so even upbringing of just someone that might feel like they're just being Uber confident with you and you got to stay focused, you got to stay positive, can lead to this sense of imposter syndrome as you grow up and have these experiences. Also the simple fear that you won't live up to others expectations, or even your own. These are all simple triggers that can really get to us in this, this syndrome.

Christy  

I think I've had every single trigger. Not once, but like every single trigger as you were like going through them. I'm like, yep, check, check, check, like and maybe in the last week, last year, it's all very recent, I tested for a big exam. And it was like four exams before I got certified. And I didn't want any attention. Because I didn't want to fail, right? I didn't want people to know if I failed. And so I didn't want recognition for it. I just wanted to keep my head down. And then after I passed, I had this weird kind of conflicting, I don't really want to celebrate, because then I don't feel like I can back this up. Even though I just clearly proved like I could actually pass these exams with the knowledge that I had gained. I'm like, I'm like, No, I don't maybe I'm not gonna be able to back it up. Now. What you just proved you could like what is going on with you? It was just terrible. Just wanted to enjoy it. And I like my brain wouldn't let me

Marlena  

I'm, I'm laughing because I'm like, you know, this whole episode is on impostor syndrome. Like, I feel so much yester syndrome with it. And that I was like, Okay, I need to really prep because do I know what I'm talking about? I mean, I know I felt it. But Am I smart enough to do this, peeling back the onion. As we were discussing with Meredith, it's rooted from a lot of insecurities that I have, from when I was a kid from the whole sandwich, spelling, you know, over sandwich, and then me not feeling smart enough. And so in those instances, I feel like I've sabotaged parts of my life, because I refuse to step into my power and play big. And, you know, be big enough to say, Yes, I can actually do this. And yes, I am smart. And even with my career, I sit there and I'm like, why are you paying all this money to to do this? Right, high school dropout, I dropped out of high school and ended up getting my GED like, you know, so it's for me, that feeling of not being enough. Oh, my gosh, and it's not just in that. I mean, Jamie and I, we grew up in a predominantly white town, especially at the time that we were growing up there. And so for me, it was like, I'm not white enough. Well, yeah, I'm not white. By then I'm also I'm Chamorro. But I'm second generation born in the States. So I'm also not Chamorro enough. So where do I belong? I don't belong anywhere, you know, or at least that's how I felt or at times was made to feel I get

Jamie  

that too. I understand because you would hang out with your people. I have finger quotes right now you know, your other brown people. And because of where I was from where you were from where we grew up, oh, you're from the rich town. Oh, you go to that school you're one of those rich bitches like I was always the outcast on both sides. Always have great friends and I'll and had a really good high school experience, but fitting in and feeling like an imposter on either side of the spectrum. Right? I wasn't fitting in with where I was growing up, but I wasn't fitting in with the group I was supposed to be with. So but yeah, I can relate to that. I know. For me, I find my imposter syndrome really kicks in on a personal level with being a wife, being a mother being better for my self, even in this spiritual journey. I'm like, okay, am I doing this right? I don't even know if I'm doing it. Right. And I know it's just supposed to feel right but I feel like I'm faking it or I'm forcing it. I don't even know if I know what I'm talking about. And is this what it's supposed to feel like? Even in my spiritual journey, I'm I'm questioning who am I? What am I doing? And is this what it's supposed to be? Or am I just like a big, fatty or impostor? But definitely in my personal life, it really kicks in, in my being a mother. And being a wife. I know, that's where it really gets to me, because I think a lot of it too, is social media. Right? So I can't keep up with the Joneses. I can't I'm not the mom, doing all the things. And then I start doubting myself, am I doing enough? Maybe I'm just not that great of a mom, you know? And same as, as with my husband. I love him. He's the love of my life. But sometimes I question Am I good enough? Am I Am I being enough for him? You know, and that's where my, my syndrome kicks in, is on the personal level. So in doing some research with impostor syndrome, there have been a lot of studies put out there. And this particular article that I happen to find on LinkedIn, because they actually have some good information out there, talked about five different types of impostor syndrome. And as I was scrolling through them, I thought, hmm, I probably could fit in something somewhere with every single one. And I think we could probably relate to them. So one of the ones they discussed was called the expert, right? So you may not like to be called the expert as it might make you feel like you need to have all the answers. And you feel the pressure to live up to such a high standard. So you're being expected to have all the answers, you're the expert, but then you've don't feel confident enough that you have the answers, kind of I believe, like your story, Christy, you were saying you just had all this knowledge you just did, and you have the answers. But did you feel like you did? Nope.

Christy  

No, not at all. Like in maybe not even in that experience, but just in personal experiences. You know, I'm like, It's better now. But before it'd be like, I would say very far away. I don't want anyone to think I'm an expert. I don't want it because it's gonna make me feel insane. It's I'm gonna feel crazy, because I'm like, I can't be the expert for you. But now, it's a little better. Because before I didn't like saying to someone, well, I don't have that answer. Right. That felt very, like I was dumb, or Yeah, but I've learned that saying, I don't have the answer is okay. Because nobody has all the fucking answers all the time. So you know, you can say that, and you can say, we got to take a beat I I'll go find the answer for you. But I don't have it. So this one, I think I've, I've kind of I don't, I will never say I mastered but I've kind of quieted this specific expert syndrome, because it was causing havoc in my professional life, especially.

Marlena  

I agree with you there. Because in my professional life, I've run a law firm, you know, people are coming to me for answers. And I've even had someone be like, well, you don't have all the answers. And I'm like, No, I hire people with answers. Like, I'm not required to know everything. And so I've kind of stepped into my power in that, in that aspect, where I'm like, I don't know everything. But I do know how to hire people that know more than me or in right in certain areas.

Jamie  

And so same here, I think with me with with work that I did have doubts that sometimes I felt like Okay, can I really do this? I'd like being that go to person. I don't know if I would consider myself as the expert. I just really thrived on being a go to person and then if I didn't know the answer was, I'll figure that out for you. And then ship no scramble. So yeah, I get that. But I did thrive on being that that go to and I just, I don't know, again, fake faked it till I made it. I just, you know, I'll just roll with the punches and pretend like I know everything. I get it, but it's okay. It's okay. In the end, I realized, guess what? I don't have to know everything. And it was okay to tell someone. I don't know. You don't want to ask my boss. The next syndrome that they have is the Super Woman slash man. Because again, yes, this does affect men too. So if you fit into this category, you are already convinced that you're a fraud amongst your peers. You push yourself to work harder, and you do it and overdo it all the time to measure up. You're an overachiever, you might be considered a workaholic and addicted to the validation that comes with working rather than work itself. So this is someone that is just they need that validation. They need the pat on the back. They need to know that they're good enough and be told that and I don't I don't get me wrong. I like that. rotation at work. I don't know if I can fall into this category because I, I'm okay if I don't get it. But I definitely have known people who who have to deal with this for sure.

Marlena  

Oh, I'm totally that person. That is that is 100% me. I am that person. So, again, I think it really stems from insecurities, you know, insecurities that are rooted from when I was younger, and again, because I would sabotage everything that I would do. So that, you know, people wouldn't think that I was good enough. It's so I proved it to them kind of thing. And now I need people to tell me that, yes, I am doing a good job, and especially at work, but that falls into even this podcast where I'm just like, an episode goes out and I'm like, cringe, and you know, so to get the feedback and be like, that was a really good episode. It's like, okay, okay, you know, but or, you know, yeah, that was your best. I'm like, Yeah, I sabotage that one, too.

Jamie  

Yeah, it's funny that you bring up. I shouldn't say it's funny, but we discuss all of us feeling impostor syndrome with the podcast. And little side note, I actually don't listen to the podcast we record because I know I'm going to do nothing but criticize myself. And question why is said that you sound horrible. What are you doing talking about this, you don't even know what you're doing. So definitely impostor syndrome. In that area. With this show,

Marlena  

we'll see the Superwoman version of imposter syndrome. When it comes to this podcast. That is me. Because now I've learned how to not overdo it with work and have work life balance. But now I have this podcast and because I am having all of this impostor syndrome, I'm like, it has to be just right. So I listened to it, like, the next day after we've recorded and I'm jotting down my notes and, you know, I may give the notes to my mom, or, or she'll send it to me, and I listened to the episode and be like, okay, you know, maybe we should do this. Or maybe we should do that most of the time, let me be real. I listened. I listened to it all the time, and thinking of what to cut out, but for the most part, mom does an excellent job of editing. So, but there's times where I'm just like, Okay, I said this, and I didn't mean to say this, or I didn't want to say this, or, you know, whatever. And I'm constantly listening to the episodes. And then I listened to it when it comes out. And I just completely overdo it. I'm overworking it, then we have certain topics. And I'm like, and I know about the stuff like I know, I know, I know it. But then I over research, you know, and that's kind of the way I've been in the legal field, too. I do all of this research, and I'm over researching and trying to figure things out. And so I'm doing the same thing with this. But now, more so with this. And I just yeah, my brain just doesn't stop. Because you have impostor syndrome all the time. Everybody just heard my brain.

Jamie  

Just throw up all over the podcast. No, but I get it. I get it. Christy, what do you think of the Superwoman?

Christy  

Well, I mean, I'll say like years ago, I really needed the validation from work like, but there was a lot going on. There was I was in a situation work situation, that wasn't the greatest. But I remember like having two or three different jobs, I was going to school I was I was like, doing all these things, filling my days and still managing to have like, a social life. And I remember one day just feeling really high on myself. And I told I made the mistake of telling my family that I was amazing. And like, in a way of like, I'm amazing. Like, I mean, you know, and it was just funny to me cute. My whole family was like, wow, okay, she's amazing. So now it's this joke that just continues and so anytime I do anything, they just say, oh, Christy is amazing. Look how amazing Christie is I'm like shot. But I did that to myself. So yeah, so years ago, it was it was all about, like, how much can I do? Right? And it was all work related, work related, school related, career related, how much can I do in my day, and still have somewhat of a life manage those things to show everybody that I was worth something right or to just like, show them like how hard I could work and still maintain my life outside of my career. And I was a lot younger so we'll also put that caveat in but like it really was just the validation of it all because getting validation from so many people and it it really built me up. It made me feel so good. That then I went and told my family how good I was and then they brought me down to two sighs so it all worked out.

Jamie  

It all worked out.

Marlena  

That in itself is a part sort of imposter syndrome as well as having an inflated ego. I mean, you see someone with an inflated ego. And really, they are extremely insecure and they have their own impostor syndrome going on.

Jamie  

It's so it's having to be almost overly confident in order to make sure that everyone sees you as such, even if you don't feel that way. Yeah, exactly.

Marlena  

That was me. A lot of my life as well. No, I'm just like, I am not perfect. I don't know shit. All right. I am okay with it. I've stopped with it. And I just want to work on my podcast. I don't want to work

Jamie  

in Texas a lot during the day. I don't want to do the real stuff. I want to do the fun.

Marlena  

Exactly. I just want to do fun stuff. Yeah.

Christy  

And I'm, I'm okay being less amazing than I was in my 20s. It's fine. I'm good with that. Now.

Jamie  

I'm okay with being somewhat amazing. I don't need to be

Christy  

mediocre. Like I'm high. On average. Now.

Jamie  

It's fine. You lukewarm. Yeah. lukewarm. So good. lukewarm. Okay. And then of course, there's the soloist? Do you identify with being a soloist? Then you might be someone who doesn't want to ask for help? Oh, wow, I can relate to this. You might be afraid to ask any questions and want to do it yourself. This is because you think asking for help means you are a fraud, huh? Yeah, definitely can relate to that. Definitely. I think there's always been moments in my life where I don't want to ask for help for a lot of reasons, not just because I feel like if I ask for help, then I don't I look like I don't know what I'm doing. But just also the part that I just need to do it myself. Because then you know, I do it, and no one else will touch it.

Marlena  

And then it's right. When I

Christy  

suffer from that, too.

Jamie  

I'll just take care of it. No, show me what needs to be done. Nope, nope, it's good. It's like I can get it done.

Marlena  

No, because it won't be done correctly if you do it. But I can definitely

Jamie  

remember what situations where I was in a new, I don't know, I CrossFit is actually probably a good one when I first became certified to train, and teach, and coach and I spent hours studying, doing tests and spent the entire weekend getting drilled and like all the tests in front of the certification trainers at CrossFit and all these things, and it was like a big fucking deal. And then I go to teach my first class and I'm like, shit, oh, no, are they gonna think I'm like, legit? I don't know, just because of this little paper that says I am. They don't know the time and effort I put into it. But I still doing my first class, I felt like oh my god, okay, am I gonna be able to do this. And in CrossFit, you would get, you know, an agenda for the day, the workout of the day. And then of course, there's usually some lifting and you want to make sure your athletes are doing the right form? And are you going to make sure that it's right, and so they don't hurt themselves, and you want people to really believe in you. And I remember my first few classes, almost wanting to go ask the owners of the gym, you know, hey, can you just make sure I'm doing this right? And, but outside and outwardly, I didn't want to give that feeling of fear to them. I didn't want them to feel like I wasn't confident. I mean, in CrossFit, you have to be like fucking confident. And I was teaching athletes that I had never done this before, some that have been doing it way longer than me. And trust me, even at my fittest, I don't think I felt like I looked the look of a CrossFit athlete. So I never wanted to give off a vibe of being insecure, or being in the unknown, or anyone questioning me and my ability. So there was a lot of times I remember, I didn't ask the questions, I was afraid I would look like a fraud. So with the soloist, I could definitely relate that to my early training days of CrossFit, for

Christy  

sure. And for reference, we all knew Jamie was legit before she tested for any coaching in CrossFit. Like we all knew it wasn't even a question she was legit.

Jamie  

The big you if I don't know, it was really intimidating in the beginning. And it took me a while. It took me a while to like, get comfortable and be accepting of what I knew. And what I know. I knew and that I can teach it. So thank you, Christy. That was very sweet. Can anyone relate to the soloist? Anyone else in that? That bucket? Yeah, I don't mean

Christy  

yes. And no. I mean, I feel like some of my soloist energy is more control issues. Anything else like it's less agreed, I'm going to look like a fraud and more like, like we were discussing, I'll do it myself because it will be done right. And I won't have to do it again. But in you know, the past few years tried to step away from that because I'm doing everyone else a disservice and myself a disservice by not teaching somebody how to do something correctly. Right. And I'm not talking about me it's not my way is the correct way but also it is but it's not. And so

Jamie  

my way or that way.

Christy  

You know it really lead that for me really came to light when I had kids and instead like, wanting them to do it correctly, but then oh my god, I have time to teach them and then reteach them and then teach them again right now, because I felt like it was a fraud. But just because it was like, This is my controlling way of how to do it. Yeah, so a little different. I can't I mean, I've definitely had those situations. But yeah, just a tad different in the reasons why.

Jamie  

It Yeah. Yeah. Same with you line, the more the control aspect.

Marlena  

I mean, I don't have control. I don't have any control issues.

Jamie  

Yes, we all do. And then we have the last two, and they kind of tie in together. And the first one is called the perfectionist, I think that's pretty self explanatory. But if you fall into this type, you might find it hard to accept making mistakes, you might have extraordinarily high standards for yourself and for others. So you have to be perfect. What is it perfect life perfect wife, perfect friend, perfect job. And you expect others to be perfect, too? I don't, I don't know. I don't think I can relate to this one. I'll be honest, I've never accepted things to be perfect. Let's be honest.

Christy  

What is that, like Jamie, I really want to know what that's like,

Jamie  

I feel like you fall into this syndrome. I don't know,

Marlena  

oh, I'm living in that, or yeah, not any longer, you know, I think I've done a good job of recognizing that I will never be perfect, you know, a lot of flaws. But with my kid, I'm like, you have to be the perfect martial artist, and you have to get the perfect grades. And you have to, you know, and so as a mom, you know, and again, I feel like take us back to high school, and the environment that we were in, and boy did I fuck up my kid by throwing them in the same environment where they are in a predominantly white town, and they don't feel like they belong, you know, throw all of that together. And here are all the moms that remind me of all of the young ladies that bullied me or whatever, when I was when I was younger. And these moms now remind me of the older versions of those people. And I have to deal with that. So I need to put on the perfect face. And you know, the perfect life to impress these people that I don't even give a flying fuck about. I want to sit there and just I have this perfect, amazing life. And, you know, look at all of my social media. I mean, you know, again, we talk about the highlight reels, throwing up the highlight reels of I'm doing this, this and this, when in fact I'm sitting there yelling at my kid because they're not doing their homework. And I'm sitting there cooking dinner at nine o'clock because now they're at the karate school or whatever. And you know, it's just like, nothing is actually perfect in my life is a bunch of chaos. Now I embrace the chaos. So I definitely don't feel that way. And it's also being on this podcast and being as vulnerable as we have. It's like, okay, well you just let everybody know that you don't have your show. On you know, a number of occasions, so embrace it, because guess what, nobody has their shit together is the

Jamie  

messy. That's okay. Yeah, that's okay. And I think we all have learned to embrace the messy and that it's okay. And one of the biggest things we wanted to put out there with this podcast is we wanted to be relatable. And that is that's real, right? That's real. I think as as I'm listening to your stories, I'm trying to think can I relate somehow into this bucket? The only times I feel like this still does does come back to my imposter syndrome of am I good enough wife? Am I good enough mother? Am I good? Enough woman, female, you know, am I doing enough? But this perfectionism if you will, it gonna sound really stupid. But it's when we have like parties or people over? I'm frantic about cleaning the house. Does it smell like animals? Look at the frickin baseboards are gross. And I mean, it's just like, I go into panic mode because I want it to be perfect. And Mom, if you're listening to this podcast, I highly blame you. I'm just putting it out there. I love you though. But I remember my mom as a kid working her ass. I help your mom but I'm also your daughter. So you know this, you know this. But I just remember growing up my entire life and even to this day. My mom worked her ass off every time she has a party. Every time she has fun Emily over and you want to help her but I'm very much like her. She does the same thing. Nope, I got it. I'll take care of it. And then she gets stressed and she gets frazzled because she wants everything to be perfect. She wants it to be a perfect night evening dinner for whoever's coming over. And then it ends up stressing her out. I do the exact same thing. I need it to be perfect. I need it to be perfect. I can't just like let it go. How I feel impostor syndrome sneaks in there for me is that if it doesn't look perfect, they're gonna see that I'm a mess. I don't want anyone to see that side of me not that I'm some like shit show pigsty house or anything. But you know what I mean? Like, I don't need them to see the real house. I need them to see the pretty house, the clean house, the house that smell Pinterest tells Yes. Yeah. And that's for me, where my perfectionism would come in is that I stress the shit out and making sure everything's perfect. And then at times, I don't even sit down and enjoy the party. Because I gotta get more plates. I gotta get more food I have to do you need to drink? Do you need that? Blah, blah, blah. So yeah, I need to learn to chill. But I love you, Mom, I blame you. Anyways,

Christy  

the last couple of times.

Jamie  

The last one that we have. And it actually relates to the perfectionist, it's called the natural genius. So this is very similar to the one we just discussed. You might not just focus on getting a task perfect. But you want to know all the facts and information. If you don't know everything you are greatly frustrated with yourself. I think we're

Christy  

going to Marlena on this one. Or two, okay.

Marlena  

I'm not raising my hand to be like you Oh, call on me. That is just me. And again with this with this podcast with work. It's like research, research, research research. And it's just nonstop research where I'm like, I overdo it. I completely overdo it, where I'm sitting there trying to, you know, it's like, you know, this stuff. Why are you doing this to yourself? Because I don't know it enough, apparently.

Jamie  

And you do know so much you do? I

Christy  

was just like, Yeah, you know, so much. I mean, yeah, about all of this. It's crazy. To me, sometimes I'm like, Dana,

Marlena  

I know, you think we all do, you know, we know what we know. But again, that feeling of I don't want to come off sounding stupid, or a knowledgeable or Yeah, uneducated, you know any of it, I need you to see me in my perfect form. And but that also brings me to where my imposter syndrome really creeps in is being my true authentic self, you know, I have all of these masks that I wear when I'm either at the office, or I'm doing certain things, you know, being my true authentic self. And this is me, that's where I have the toughest time because the rub is, I don't know, really who I am anymore. You know, and trying to figure that out. Like as I've gotten into this stage of my life, who am I really? And are you showing everybody who you really are? And a lot of times I'm like, I don't know, because they don't know who I am.

Jamie  

That's what we're all trying to figure out on this little this little show this little journey we're on. I know for for me, I tend to go down the rabbit hole I think we all do. Right? When we're like even just what the show we're gonna relate it to the show, trying to research for projects and topics and all the things when I start researching things, I want to know everything and then there's too much and I shut down. I literally shut down because it's almost like we have so much resources for knowledge nowadays. That is overwhelming. Where it was like when we were growing up, we went to the one Encyclopedia Britannica and that's where you got your information or the one book that they told you to read on the topic. Now. It's like you have podcasts, you have books, you have the internet, so I get so overwhelmed, and then I shut down and then I really feel like an impostor because I'm like bullshit. I don't even know what I'm talking about. But that's me in the natural genius phase.

Marlena  

What about you, Christy?

Christy  

I don't know. I'm trying to like, relate it to something because I like to know that all the information, but I don't need to know it. It doesn't really frustrate me if I don't like because there's people that in the room that are smarter than me. And I know that take my husband, for example. He knows stupid, random useless facts, but he also knows a lot of information and he retains almost everything he watches and read. Okay, like retains it and for me I can watch a documentary one night and I'll stick with me the next day and then my brain like purges it, it makes room for new information and like me, you know, I can recall certain things but like, I have been keen recall like, I don't know the entire show right from from start to finish and he'll be like, do you remember this and it'll be some detail and I'm like, no, he's like you're sitting right next to me. Two nights ago. I'm like, I understand and the answer is still no. So, so it's. So that's like, I know that about other people. There are a lot of other people in my life that are like my husband who can retain that knowledge, who has all the information, who has all the facts. And so I think I kind of just leave it to them. I think that's kind of my mentality is like, Okay, I'm not the natural genius. This other person right next to me seems to be natural genius. So we'll leave that job to them

Marlena  

in certain aspects of my life. I've gotten to that point. But, you know, with Vince, same thing, in our group of friends, it would be like him and someone else being like, let's play trivia. And I'm like, yeah, no, I have no interest in doing that. And Vince is always like, let's play trivia. And I was like, have, like no tuner, you know, like, with music or something like that. Like Shazam. I'm like Trivial Pursuit nothing.

Jamie  

As we keep talking about this one, I think I can relate a lot of mine to school, I still to this day, I am 46 years old, I still have nightmares about being in the class college and not studying for a test or failing, or being in high school. I think I've just always struggled with learning, not in the sense of like, a true disability.

Marlena  

But like being book smart.

Jamie  

I just have never felt booksmart I struggle, it takes a lot for me to absorb information and retain it unless it's something related to say my job or something I do on a daily task, but to sit and study and focus makes me nauseous. Like I can't, I don't feel like I'm book smart enough to do that. So like I said, when I do research something or researching a topic that I'm not familiar with, I tend to shut down, because I don't think I can do it. And then I get overwhelmed with the vast amount of information out there. And I don't know why school just affected me like that. I was never, I never graduated from college. I went to college for a couple years. Because I thought that's what you're supposed to do. And I truly felt like an imposter there. I didn't feel like this is where I was supposed to be. I was faking it because I was supposed to go to college, and I struggled big time. And I totally felt like an impostor. Wow, that was like a really big breakthrough. Just now. I relate that all back to school, Jesus. Yeah. I mean, it's weird, because like I said, even to this day, I still have nightmares about being in college. And I wake up in like, cold sweats. I think because I felt like I was failing everyone, right? Again, imposter syndrome. I was trying to keep up to the expectations of me and what was put on me and honestly, my mom was always supportive. Do what makes you happy? Do what makes you happy. If that's College, great. If it's not, it's not do something. So I just felt like I think I had that expectation for me, because that's what I'm supposed to do. It's funny because we we talk about impostor syndrome, and a lot of people might relate it to Okay, so is this just mean low self esteem, low self confidence, there is a difference, there's a difference between the two. And when you talk about confidence, it's more about what we can or cannot do something tangible, where imposter syndrome is more about who we think we are. We don't feel confident enough to feel like we belong in the room or belong on the panel or belong in a classroom. So it's who we feel. We are, are we aren't. That's where the imposter syndrome come in. Can it stem from low self esteem and low self confidence? Absolutely.

Christy  

But there is a difference between the two. So I like that differentiation, though. Because, yeah, you know, like it, it really is, for me, like, most recent example, for me, I had like a couple weeks of just real great writing. And I posted it and didn't think twice about it. I'm super confident. I'm like, post and I got reactions, right. I got people reaching out, you know, commenting and telling me how great it was. And I'm like, This feels great, right? So there's the validation, right? I'm getting validation from it. And then I guess for the last week, I've been so busy with work, I have not made a priority of my writing. And so last Friday, I was like, I need to write I want to post something. And my brain was like you are not a writer, you're going to post some crap, and nobody's going to respond. You already got your accolades and your recognition the past couple of weeks, you're not going to continue to get that that was right. So it was telling me who I thought I was right. You're not a writer right? And I'm just like, where did that come from? I was having such a great like, you know, just so many great days of this What the heck is happening and so today, it was a forced five minutes note No joke, five minute prompt. I wrote, I posted I walked away and I had to just kind of be like, I am a writer, even without the recognition, the accolades the validation, I am this person, I am a writer and that is so Hard for me to continually like believe about myself, which is crazy

Marlena  

for me because I think you're an amazing writer.

Christy  

But then you say that I'm like, Oh, God, I can't put anything else out. Because what if it's shit? You know, like, I'm like, there you go. Right. So it's just this cycle for like, of just, you know, and I have to quiet it's man. It's hard. It's rough. Inner Critic green. Yeah. Also the Inner Inner Critic coming in, but telling you you're not this person. Yeah. And also, like, you know, like we talked about before on the podcast, you're not a podcaster nobody's gonna listen to you like, Why? Why should they listen to you? And so but we get on every week. And we're here. And hopefully someday, I will be able to say, I am a podcaster. And I won't shy away when people are like, Oh, you're a podcaster? No, I'm not. No, I just, I'm on a podcast. And they're like, but your podcast, Mike? No. Not really not yet.

Marlena  

Yeah, that's funny that you bring that up, because I was speaking to a very dear friend the other day and the podcast came up, and I minimalized the podcast, and she was like, Don't you fucking do that? Don't do that. She was like, Don't minimalize it, you're doing something that most people are afraid to do, and don't have the balls to do. So don't do that. So, and I needed to hear that too. Because there are times and I was like, You know what, you're right. I take that back. You know, because there are times where I'm just like, oh, you know, my little podcast. And and it's like, I'm again, doing something courageous, going back to being brave, and it scares the crap out of me. But yeah, here I am actually, scared as hell, but still doing it. impostor syndrome at all.

Jamie  

I think I'm gonna add it to my signature in my emails and be like, sincerely, Jamie, where podcaster? Maybe that'll make it official, I don't know. And so, all these imposter syndrome, personality types, things we can relate to. And I don't ever feel like and this might sound bad, but this is me. I don't ever feel like it'll ever completely go away. But we can definitely work towards making it better. Right?

Marlena  

I agree with you. I think impostor syndrome is going to creep in, you know, with who is everybody at some point or another, it's a matter of figuring out ways to quiet the noise.

Jamie  

Quiet, the noise, quiet, that inner critic inside that's telling you, you're not good enough. You don't know what you're doing? Why are you here, but there are things we can do. You know, talk about it. Share your feelings with others, your friends, your family, journaling helps if you need to, if you don't want to discuss it with people, maybe it's something you have to write down. And definitely celebrate your successes. Don't try and minimize them. Don't say, Oh, I only won because so and so. was not there or whatever. You know what I mean? It just don't minimize it. Like you earned it. We talked a lot about perfectionism. Like, let it go, like, yeah, what's the movie, let it go, Elsa, let it go, like just frozen. There you go. But also cultivate some self compassion, and accept that imposter syndrome may like we just said, it may never go away, share your failures. So just as you celebrate successes, talk about the bad moments too, because that makes it real, and that makes you real. And that's okay. Because we do have to fail in order to keep moving on. So celebrate your successes, share your failures. And then of course, you know, look at the big picture, right. And I think that's where I find peace, when that impostor syndrome kicks in with, like, I said, me being a good enough wife, good enough, mom, I have to step back and go, You know what, my kids are happy, they're healthy. They love me unconditionally. I have a husband, who I am literally with 24/7. Because we work together, you know, he's still here. We've been married for 16 years. Like there's something to be said about that. And we itch for our Friday night date nights just to spend time together, even though I've seen his face literally every day, right? But picking it apart, look at what's been happening and look at the big picture of what the situation is. And that'll just help you work through those impostor feelings that we get when they creep up.

Christy  

And don't let it stop you from right doing things right. Because just like with the inner critic, and we discussed, you know, that it can hold you from experiencing some awesome things because of the fear. Right, right. And the imposter syndrome can hold you in just because it's telling you you are not that person. And so you might miss out on some really great thing, right? I mean, had I listened, I would have not been in podcast, right? Like had I listened to imposter syndrome. I was like, sorry, that's I'm not a podcaster it's just it's not gonna happen. So we're good. Thanks.

Jamie  

I did it because it sounded fun. And I thought maybe my mom would listen. I mean, I was like, okay, it'll be fun. I get to hang out with Marlena and Christine. Maybe mom will listen to it.

Christy  

And then you just called her out now it was really like wow, while they're out on this episode, yeah for cleaning her baseboard. She's She doesn't watch the time. Let's be honest.

Marlena  

Clip I'm gonna tag my mom to our I'm sure

Jamie  

she'll agree with me.

Marlena  

You will agree with me, I love.

Christy  

And then the other thing I wanted to say something I've learned, or I've been utilizing for celebrating your successes. I'm not very good at that. Because again, impostor syndrome, so I let people around me close friends, celebrate with me, are celebrating for me, right? And encouraged me to celebrate. And well, it doesn't always bring me out of it. It definitely helps to have people surrounding you that are like, Look, if you're not going to celebrate yourself, we're going to celebrate you. So let's do this. Let's go out to dinner. Let's celebrate that recent success, the promotion, whatever it is, and then eventually, at some point in the night, I'm like, Yeah, I'm fucking proud of myself. Okay, I belong here, right? So find those people and allow them to do that for you. It feels weird, at least it does to me, because you're just not in that same headspace. But it does, for sure helped me in those moments. And there you go. There you go. So we hope that you enjoyed this episode on impostor syndrome, and that you can really utilize some of the tips, maybe identify where you fall in some of these categories, and that it kind of resonated with you at some point. Also, we have a website, which I know we've plugged, but it's w m f pod.com. We would love for you to go check it out, submit a question, and we can have a question episode segment, whatever, which was like super psyched about Marlena.

Marlena  

One of the things that I would love is for our listeners to submit a question that way at the end of each episode, we can read that question out and answer these questions. So that's what I would love for you guys to do. So please do so you can go to our website, submit that question. Also rate review, you can listen to past episodes, read our blogs, there's a lot of stuff in there. As you know, we've also had guests on the show. So to get guest information, you can get that on your website,

Christy  

and we look forward to connecting with you and seeing you hearing you talking to you on a future episode.